working4christ2 A Question for Lutherans - One, Holy, Catholic, and Apostolic

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#1   Today, 9:01 am

christus_vincit Junior Member   Join Date: January 24, 2014 Posts: 259 Religion: Roman Catholic

A Question for Lutherans - One, Holy, Catholic, and Apostolic Do Lutherans make the claim that Lutheranism is one, holy, catholic, and apostolic? If so, how do Lutherans defend this position? How is the Lutheran position on these four characteristics comparable to the position of the Catholic Church? __________________ Fallacies do not cease to be fallacies because they become fashions. -G.K. Chesterton

#2   Today, 9:32 am

benjohnson Regular Member   Join Date: May 16, 2012 Posts: 2,362 Religion: Lutheran - LC-MS

Re: A Question for Lutherans - One, Holy, Catholic, and Apostolic Quote: Originally Posted by christus_vincit Do Lutherans make the claim that Lutheranism is one, holy, catholic, and apostolic? If so, how do Lutherans defend this position? How is the Lutheran position on these four characteristics comparable to the position of the Catholic Church? Yes we profess that - it's in the creeds. It's generally not an exclusive claim - we generally view the OHCAC as where the Gospel is proclaimed and the Sacraments are administered. From an outsider's viewpoint, it may look like a silly claim - our church has issues, our liturgy is a mess, and our numbers as small. Yet those things have nothing to do with our strength and refuge in Christ and Him crucified. As I understand it, the larger sticking point among Catholics to our claim is Apostolic Succession - in that while we desire it as a continuation of the Western Church, we're content with holding to the apostolic teaching of the historic church. I certain there will be wiser Lutherans on this forum that will expand on this - I just wanted to get my $.02 in so it looks like I'm paying attention

#3   Today, 9:37 am

adf417 Regular Member   Join Date: November 25, 2011 Posts: 1,044 Religion: Catholic

Re: A Question for Lutherans - One, Holy, Catholic, and Apostolic Quote: Originally Posted by benjohnson Yes we profess that - it's in the creeds. It's generally not an exclusive claim - we generally view the OHCAC as where the Gospel is proclaimed and the Sacraments are administered. From an outsider's viewpoint, it may look like a silly claim - our church has issues, our liturgy is a mess, and our numbers as small. Yet those things have nothing to do with our strength and refuge in Christ and Him crucified. As I understand it, the larger sticking point among Catholics to our claim is Apostolic Succession - in that while we desire it as a continuation of the Western Church, we're content with holding to the apostolic teaching of the historic church. I certain there will be wiser Lutherans on this forum that will expand on this - I just wanted to get my $.02 in so it looks like I'm paying attention Ben, you are paying way to much for attention.

#4   Today, 10:00 am

steido01 Regular Member   Join Date: October 16, 2012 Posts: 956 Religion: Evangelical Catholic (LCMS)

Re: A Question for Lutherans - One, Holy, Catholic, and Apostolic Quote: Originally Posted by christus_vincit Do Lutherans make the claim that Lutheranism is one, holy, catholic, and apostolic? Yup! Ben pretty much nailed it. We confess and profess the Faith as recorded in the Apostles, Nicene and Athanasian Creeds. Quote: Originally Posted by christus_vincit If so, how do Lutherans defend this position? In big, heavy books. Luckily, the Book of Concord weighs a lot less on the Internet: http://bookofconcord.org/ Quote: Originally Posted by christus_vincit How is the Lutheran position on these four characteristics comparable to the position of the Catholic Church? Well, you can read for yourself. Rome responded in the Confutation to the Augsburg Confession: http://bookofconcord.org/confutatio.php But it is usually considered a poor response by all sides, so a fuller picture requires looking at the Council of Trent. The best Lutheran response to Trent would probably be Martin Chemnitz's Examination of the Council of Trent. I have it in hardcopy, but I don't know if it's available online. __________________ Don Soli Deo Gloria! I'm just a layman.

#5   Today, 10:01 am

MaryT777 Regular Member   Join Date: November 23, 2012 Posts: 5,492 Religion: Catholic

Re: A Question for Lutherans - One, Holy, Catholic, and Apostolic Always love to hear answer from our Lutheran friends... Mary.